So those of us who follow Kailyn know that shes been obsessively trying to sell her old shit lately; cell phones, computer, games, etc. so she was probably ~thrilled~ when someone finally agreed to buy one of her scratched-up phones. We know Kailyn is not the brightest girl we've ever seen, but whatever lonely neurons she DOES have hiding up in her brain were clearly not being used when she mailed away her phone without first deleting all the pictures stored on it. All 200 + pictures. Whoooopss.
Heres a little preview;
O IS THAT OREGANO TOO?
werq gurl
Credit: anon
Kai's only real-life friend speaks out;
Wednesday, August 25, 2010
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«Oldest ‹Older 4601 – 4800 of 4975 Newer› Newest»Euchante claims that she gets money from her boutique. And I think she's partnered on both of her channels.
right now, stephbusta is my favorite. i also really like xheavensentx1.
mallobean1, xxmichaeljames, carahamelie03, casanchez18, courtneylici0us, kitcat627
I watch most of them for personality/style than actual advice.
damn that pinklady girl is so defensive! she talks in caps lock
lulz, this pinkladyj is my new fave since Kai is missing. How old is she really? She looks like a 30 year old trying to be "young again".
How many fucking times does she say arbitrarily in her hair video??
i'm surprised that she's not obsessed with japan and anime. she has every other characteristic of a deviantart tard lulz
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2Xq4q1wCk4
dis my jam
@10:36
EricaLeigh777 is a good one. Unfortunately she hasn't been very active since her pregnancy. But she still has some great videos up on her channel.
StillGlamorus is good too.
Love them both!
well she did do sailor moon tutorials, so maybe it's a secondary obsession. but yeah, dragons, metal, fantasy. please stop yelling at me, lady.
http://www.yourfilehost.com/media.php?cat=image&file=3641IMG_0261jpeg.jpg
UNCENSORED KAI VAG DIMPLEEEEEEEEEEEE
She seriously has all of her makeup listed on an excel spreadsheet.. somebody has no life..
lolol
i don't get why dulcecandy is so popular.
I thought everybody kept track of their makeup that way.
:?
i'd love to see this girl on what not to wear, she seems like the type too bitch at clinton and stacy about her personal style!
if you need to "keep track" of your makeup, it probably means you have too much.
@11:25
Sarcasm, dear.
i know bb, i was talking about the crazy lady with the excel sheets lol.
she wouldn't have near as much to keep up with if she didn't have fifty million coastal scents palettes.
why do all the gurus like twatlight? seriously that shit is fucking awful
dead
can't sleep ugh
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJ9_NgIMZ2s
favorite kai troll video ever, so many golden quotes
HEY EVERYJUAAAAAAAAAAAAN is kai still missing?
RIP KAI :'(
lmao i swear if kai comes back with a vlog and says she's been busy with work/friends again...
what the FUCK is ladyj saying at the beginning of her videos. ello govna? I want to slap her.
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l7wrx2QUPo1qaznno.gif
xxmichaeljames is faboosh he's like a white petrilude minus the dick attitude and anal fisting.
Whoever it was that came here and recomendee the baking soda hair detox. THANK YOU. <3 my hair is so cash right now.
i was reading on babynames.com and apparently some celeb couple named their kid
Kai David Singh Stenson LOL
I wonder if Robin's trailer will survive the storm
WtF happened to Blairxx she disappeared from youtube and deleted all her videos
oh god that mall0bean girls voice. ick. she seems sweet though.
lol Robin lives in Bowie which is no where near Earl's path - but nice try, bb.
I feel like as a part tme job pinkladyj works at a renissance festival of some kind.
this girl has the ugliest bag ever..
I feel like as a part tme job pinkladyj works at a renissance festival of some kind.
sorry for the double post.
vadisrad lets bash her
mehh she's pretty average looking. her nose is kinda big and she needs to take out that shitty piercing.
kinda big? shes boring. Lets face it we need Kai back.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJ9_NgIMZ2s
"just comment down below HELLLLLLLO" hahaha
davit get in here and tell us where kai is!
"DAVEY! You shouldn't be talkin', fatass!"
"THat was photoshop davey!!!" LOL
WHos mark!?!?!
"i love... not you. you have fucked up eyebrows"
I found the ugliest girl on YouTube!!! Dancinash24x7. YT recommended her videos to me, and then my eyes started to bleed. :(
why is it so dead?
and where is lady kaka?!?!??!?!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DY0v9V7TYs
Here's one of her videos. Those boots are so tacky, and Coach is for white trash. I can't believe she's serious. What do you guys think?
Imaging Kailyn crying just makes me Lol
LOOL xsparkage is ~growin up~ hopefully she stops wearing those Hot Topic skinny jeans and vans *hopes*
RIP KAI :(
LOL dancinash is one of kais favorite gurus, no wonder.
holy shit dancinash you are pure perfection. N00DS PLZ
i really hope her mom finally took her internet away or gave her some form of punishment. but i doubt anything changed, kai is prob gonna come back with a monster haul.
ew gross i went on specktra to find swatches for mac pink plaid (anyone have/like this?) and wtf:
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh166/angelbunny31/MACLips4.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh166/angelbunny31/MACLips6.jpg
this is so fucking disgusting. what the hell did she do to her lips?
HAWT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vu9yGGrftas
oh my.
LOL BLUE LIPS 4 LYF
10:11 wtff ahhh
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9oU_aPpJXk GURUS EXPOSED INTERVIEWWWWW WITH ROBIN
gonna go watch robin's new vids brb
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DY0v9V7TYs
Christ...shes so beautiful
her mom was raised the way she raises kai, it's like a fucking cycle.
hahah omg robin
OMG ROBINS NEW VIDEO!
Hearing Kai outloud as Kay sounds weird :/
i like that guruexposed actually asked us for questions and shared it with us, unlike ytexposed.
i knew it was a cycle!
wtf mama wilcher and papa wilcher arent even divorced yet even though they've been separated for like 7 years now.
god robin has the weirdest speaking style.
blah bla hehehe blah
oh, i was wondering why mama wilcher didn't go back to her maiden name.
lol kai is socially awkward and doesn't understand personal space. and LMFAO at people in kai's town knowing about her and her videos and laughing at her
Lmao, I can picture Kai breathing down your neck and being too close. Gross.
LOL U MAD DAVIT? robin said other people in her town laugh at her and don't like her. THEY ALL JUST JELUZ!
ok, as much as i like to make fun of kai, i think robin has taken it too far.
nobody needs their abortion to be public knowledge like this, even if kai's a total idiot she still has feelings.
Kai has no feelings
omg, so her town probably saw her nudes too right??
wow she actually said something nice about davey
THE PEOPLE IN BOWIE ARE JUST JEALOUS OF KAI!!
lmao love robin
10:31 #2 i agree.
Mama Wheelchair
Kai has feelings?
why are you telling robin to stop making videos about kai? it's not like you even watch her channel for anything else, especially not her makeup tutorials.
loololllllll 10:59
KAI HAS NO SOUL OR CONSCIENCE
i love that robin only confirms stuff that we've already speculated.
wouldn't it be amazing if lizzy backstabbed her precious lauren and we'd get videos from her?
kai was on youtube an hour ago. so much for taking her internet away.
11:02 talking about someone else's abortion just because they "copy" the songs you like and stupid little girl shit like that is ridiculous, and robin needs a slap in the face
So if she had a better reason, it would be okay for her to call Kai out?
seriously, all of you hate kai and now that someone's doing videos about her, you're her white knights?
fuck that. kai is a fucking 20 year old CHILD - no job, no prospects, no friends, no LIFE. she needs to be put in her place.
robin's shit is getting old. i just want kai vids.
"needs to be put in her place"
LOL how does any of this affect you? How does Kailyn not having a job directly affect you? How does Kailyn having no friends affect you? Holy shit, why do you people care so much?!?!?
IA Robin's a fucking idiot!
robins voice is the most annoying thing i've ever heard.
I agree.... All of you were pretty much begging for someone to come forward and call Kai out and confirm things. Now that someone is, you're taking it back? Seriously, this is like when gurus come to the blog and suddenly everyone is nice to them. Make up your fucking minds already.
lol @ anyone worrying about robin taking it too far when you talk shit about her everyday and post her nudes on this blog.
I JUST WANT KAI VIDSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS KAI KAI KAI KAIII <3
11:20 "all of you"? i don't even recall "begging" for someone to do this. i was quite happy watching kai for the lulz. i do however think there is something wrong with robin talking publicly about kai's abortion.
Ummm I've never "begged" anyone OR have talked shit about Kai's nudes. Not all of us are the same people, dumbass.
11:19 how does anyone saying anything affect you? why do you care about what we say so much?
you see how we can turn every hater comment the other way around.
kai does have friends.robin said she has 2 friends in real life.
lol this blog should change it's name to KAIGOSSIP because you guys never talk about anything else.
lmao i swear some of you secretly love kai.
I love hearing "Mama Wilcher" being said out loud by Robin!!!
"Ummm I've never "begged" anyone OR have talked shit about Kai's nudes. Not all of us are the same people, dumbass."
Yet you're on a blog dedicated to bashing her?
11:23 - Cool, except you guys are being enormous assholes. Harmless gossip is fun, that's what this blog should be about. You guys are fucking pathetic, your parents are quite possibly shittier than Kailyn's.
i talked about kandee but no one gave a shit even though her drama is LEGIT<3
it's not legit, it's old news.
11:23 :( no one else has done anything lately. Elle and Blair haven't sold anything lately, no one cares about Kimi anymore. Kalel is still a birdbrain. CityandSchnoz won her stupid competition and hasn't been gloating about it as much as we expected.
there's no scandal other than this one.
ITS FUCKING INTERESTING, CUNT. :)
she switched a foundation bottle, ALERT THE MEDIA RIGHT NAO!
Why is everyone mad at my Queen Robin?!?! This is what you all wanted, myself included. I'm just disappointed we didn't get any more info. Robin is just confirming things we all ready knew. She's a retard. She had an abortion. Mama Wilcher is a loser. Kai hasn't a mind of her own/she's a total copy cat, she was lying about her job. We want to know the stuff we don't know!!!
I like the fact that robin is answering questons about kai. mean alot of people asked for them. Its what i want to hear. But at the same tme i need my ka vids back!
"Yet you're on a blog dedicated to bashing her?" I wasn't aware this was a blog dedicated to Kailyn. I thought this was a place to laugh at the dumb thing beauty gurus say and do, but this shit is malicious. I'd rather show my tits to some random dude on webcam than talk shit about a girl who is OBVIOUSLY mentally disabled. I'm sure your parents would be fucking proud.
she's fuckign lying to her teen groupies. claiming true match is a good foundation (when it's actually a piece of shit)
11:25 cool, except my parents raised me to be someone who has a full time job while going to university full time. i have a proper boyfriend and more than "two friends".
spending a couple of hours on a dinky little blog making fun of people has no bearing on what my parents did when they were raising me, and the same can be said for everyone else's parents.
kai took the nude pictures and sold them on a phone without deleting them. that was her own stupidity's fault. i personally don't know if i agree with them being posted online, but i admit i did find it funny. i was able to be apathetic because they're only nude photos, kai's been through it all before and she is the one who sold them.
HOWEVER, with the abortion "scandal" i find my sympathies edging towards kai more than ever. kai may seem quite 2D to us online, but really, that is a real girl who has confided in others about her abortion who have used the information as a form of revenge for her asking for necklaces and "copying" them. that's not funny in my opinion.
I like how the same person keeps pretending to be multiple people. Too bad the blog haters ALWAYS come and leave at the same exact time.
i love how ppl are bashing other's parents. THE ONLY FUCKED UP PARENT HERE IS MAMA WICLHER LOLOLOL
my parents would be so ashamed of me visiting this blog for lulz when i'm bored when i'm not working, out or at school. they would much rather me sit at home on my ass all day like kai. :'(
@11:29 i wonder if there's something else robin's not mentioning. like you know how people just let things go and then one thing makes them snap, but they don't really remember other things that pissed them off beforehand?
lol my bad explanation, but it's happened to me before. i'm sure a few years of kai copying her pushed her buttons enough for her to just snap, albeit in a pretty immature way.
11:28 you really don't see how hypocritical that sounds? making fun of people is one thing but making fun of someone who is mentally disabled is not fucking okay. I admit I've laughed at some of her videos but some of the shit said here as been really malicious and cruel. Do you honestly not realize that?
11:32 Wow, I'm so sorry you were raised by parents that think picking on mentally disabled people is okay. It makes sense though.
@11:30, you are fucking stupid.
Robin's hair is sooooo 90s someone should let her know...
Just because someone has a disability (which you don't even know for sure, so stop) they're allowed to get away with everything. Should Warren also get away with being a perv because he's in a wheelchair? How about Ingram? He's obviously not right in the head, he has some form of disability there. Should he be allowed to keep being a pedophile?
Being lazy and greedy isn't a disability.
she's not mentally disabled, though. are you not getting that?
it's confirmed from mama wilcher and kai (through robin) that she doesn't have any diagnosed mental illnesses. not FAS (although it's a shame she looks so much like that diagram, huh), not autism or aspergers.
idk when mama said it in the blogtv, i believed her.
11:35 - What exactly has she gotten away with? Not having a job? Isn't that her mom's problem? It's not your problem. Like, it's not your problem AT ALL. It's not like she dropped on a house on your fucking mom.
11:35 #2 - Whatever helps you sleep at night.
there's that piece of robin's hair just near her left ear that i just want to thin out for her. it's definitely not cut right.
i think she'd look better with either bleached hair or brown hair, not this piss yellow nonsense.
This idiot is hilarious. Yeah, everything I do is what my parents tell me. I only have sex with my boyfriend when my parents say it's okay. I only take a crap with my parents' permission.
Why blame everything on the parents? You're being ignorant. There are societal and social influences, and because a person temporarily succumbs to those (most of us know them as "phases") our parents were shitty? I always see commenters posting about having jobs, going to school, buying cars. Yeah, our parents really did such a terrible job because during a stint in our teens or early twenties we bullied a girl who willingly told people about her abortion and freely sent nudes to people who didn't even ask for them. (Not referring to this recent scandal, but the one in the past.)
Get your head out of the fucking clouds. Not everyone is Mother Theresa like yourself and your parents.
11:36 LOL ARE YOU SERIOUS? She is SO OBVIOUSLY disabled, just because her dumbass mother says she isn't doesn't mean SHIT, she's obviously trying to shelter Kai or is in denial herself about it. Ugh.
I didn't say it was my problem but the disability excuse is ridiculous.
kai does have FAS she has all of the symtoms
FAS can not be found through any testing
the only way to find out if someone has FAS is if they have the symptoms of it and kai does have every last one
whether kai is disabled or not is irrelevant. robin is an immature cunt and i can't believe you all kiss her ass just because she talks shit about kai.
Well you seem to have no problem blaming everything on Kai's mom, so why can't we blame your shitty behavior on your own mom?
GOD FORBID SOMEONE IS FUCKING LAZY, UGLY AND DOESN'T WANT TO GET OFF OF THEIR FAT ASS. THEY MUST BE MENTALLY RETARDED!
11:37 then nothing is technically our problem. you know what's not your problem? us talking about things that aren't our problems! it's just a time waster.
none of this is teaching kai anything, bc believe me, she's been through worse. just like after pot pie nudes, she'll be back under a new or her current username, making videos like nothing's happened.
@11:39 #4 Excellent argument, you are truly an academic.
~Well you do it so I'm going to prove you're stupid by doing the same thing!~
11:41 man you really don't get it do you?
ROBIN LOOKS LIKE A HORSE.
i really don't think kai has a mental disability or FAS. shes extremely uneducated, socially awkward, and very unfortunate looking. i do think that she has a learning disability, each is completely different than a mental disability.
People with Asperger's tend to have higher IQs than the normal population, whereas Kai can't even read. Who has been telling her she's an Aspie? Maybe those imaginary doctors that ignore her FAS.
You don't find that sad, though? The fact that history keeps repeating itself and she never learns from her mistakes? I'm not speaking for everyone on this blog but I legitimately hope Kai gets help. Her parents/boyfriend obviously aren't doing anything. I don't even like Kai but it's sad that she's so naive.
"ROBIN LOOKS LIKE A HORSE."
I just realized who Robin looks exactly like, she looks EXACTLY like Trace Cyrus. hahahhahahaha
@11:42 I do understand what you're saying, but it's stupid. You must be one of those people who think "this person disagrees with me, they obviously just don't understand. How could anyone disagree with my methods?!"
I hope Kai gets help too but I doubt she will.
you might think babying kai and keeping her oblivious is the right thing to do but it only makes it worse. she keeps doing these things because no one is telling her it's wrong. encouraging someone to make a joke out of themselves is just as wrong as calling them out. at least when people call her out, she knows that shit isn't okay.
11:44 No, of course not. No one has to agree with me, but I think it's cruel to make fun of her because whether there's proof or not, I truly believe there's something very, very wrong with her. Aside from being lazy or greedy or whatever, she's not all there.
11:39 wouldn't a doctor have confirmed it, though? idk, i admittedly don't know much about FAS, but if kai had it confirmed or had any suspicions, she'd have told someone about them, like she's told everyone everything else about her life.
on another note, i'd love to see a video from kai just addressing this. 'yes, i had an abortion. i got pregnant by stupidly not using a condom and i'm not ready/fit to have a baby. i was young and i'm more careful now.' end of. the only reason people judge her so harshly is because her head is in the fucking stars, going about her daily life like it's an episode of gossip girl.
I still think it's hilarious that you gullible fucks believe Mama Wilcher when she says Kai doesn't have a disability. Of course she'll say that; she's obviously knees deep in ten different kinds of denial, and she certainly won't tell us that she drank while pregnant. She's certainly proven her trustworthiness to the trolls by insisting Kai's dad is a lawyer and telling us Kai's never been pregnant. LET'S KEEP BLINDLY BELIEVING HER EVEN THOUGH HER 20 Y/O DAUGHTER CAN'T READ HURR DURRRRR
no one thinks babying kai is the right thing to do. her mom has made this situation a million times worse by lying to her and not providing her with the help she obviously needs. she needs to be pushed but why do it in a such a cruel way? it's unnecessary.
http://unfortunatelookingpeople.com/main.php?g2_itemId=105
kai in 20 years
"I just realized who Robin looks exactly like, she looks EXACTLY like Trace Cyrus. hahahhahahaha" I just googled a photo of him and wow. twins much?
Its obvious Kai has FAS
I don't think she has a disability because if she did, she'd tell everyone and use it for sympathy. She loves manipulating people, so why wouldn't she? No one beleived her dad is a lawyer or that she's never been pregnant, so where is your argument going? You're the one assuming she has a disability because you diagnosed her symptoms online.
@11:49 No you dummy, Mama Wilcher explicitly said Kai's normal! She doesn't have friends, has an abnormal skeletal structure, is painfully socially awkward, can't read and doesn't understand the consequences of her actions, but she doesn't have FAS! MAMA WILCHER SAID!!!!!!!!!! She's obviously a competent parent!
11:50 She doesn't even know or want to believe she has a disability because her mom is either in denial or wants to somehow protect her from her reality. Doesn't take a genius to realize she does though.
http://static.thehollywoodgossip.com/images/gallery/trace-cyrus-pic.jpg = robin hooooolllyy shit
i don't see why the people on this blog are being vilified in this situation.
it's not like david and even mama wilcher herself haven't said the exact same things.
if kai hasn't learned to not let a bunch of anonymous people get to her, that's not our problem, tbh. that's something that the people around her in real life should have taken care of.
i just don't see how kai was fine telling people about her abortion and having her nudes out there yet she's suddenly touchy about having a disabiliy? that doesn't add up.
You can tell there's something wrong with her when you look at her baby photos. No child looks like that unless there is something seriously wrong.
11:53 People with disabilities are often in denial about them. Doesn't help when their parents are too.
sadly a high IQ doesn't mean you can't be a fucking dumbass.
Why are comments being deleted? I'm tired of mods lurking and deleting comments for no reason and without any notification.
mods are assholes.
i find it funny how a bunch of teenage trolls can suddenly diagnose someone over the internet. just because you know how to Google FAS and copy and paste the results doesn't make you right. how about you go get your PhD in psychology and come back and tell us what you think about kaikaiz
"http://static.thehollywoodgossip.com/images/gallery/trace-cyrus-pic.jpg = robin hooooolllyy shit"
lol!
11:58 - I don't think she has FAS, I think she's autistic.
maybe kai doesn't want to admit she has fas because then that is admitting that here mom was/is an alcoholic and drank heavily while pregnant
look at her baby pictures that is exactly what a child born with fas looks like
and now as an adult she has all the other characteristics that you get from fas
I seriously believe Mama Wilcher knows that Kai has FAS but hasn't told Kai. Why would she? She won't even make her daughter go to school or get a job, so why would she break it to her that she has a disability? That would be, gasp, the responsible thing to do.
How would you feel if your parents told you they drank while pregnant with you and now you're retarded? Do you think Mama Dubz has the courage to have this conversation with her daughter?
You're basing your whole argument on assumptions just to make your whole opinion true though. Oh, her moms keeping it a secret and Kai doesn't know about it. Kais ugly, so she obviously has FAS. I read the symptoms online and she has all of them, so she obviously has something wrong with her! Nevermind the fact that she's never been in public school or around other kids or that her mom gave her a second graders work to get her diploma. Are all uneducated, ugly and socially awkward people also mentally challenged?
12:00 ia to a point with that. mama should have told her ages ago, if the case is that she truly has FAS or any other type of disability.
it's not fair to kai to not know why people are making fun of her.
on that front, mama should have never let kai do youtube videos. most of the people on the blog are tame compared to the other hate she gets.
@12:00 The only thing that's ugly about Kai are her neanderthal forehead, underdeveloped jawline and complete lack of philtrum-all of which are indicative of FAS. The latter *only* occurs in children with serious congenital disabilities, and you guys are conveniently ignoring that.
fuck. you can't diagnose someone without actually testing them irl. "woot look at me i can read webmd"
I don't know if she has fas or not but there is obviously some social disorder she suffers from.
12:00 I teach children music, I used to teach disabled children music. I'm obviously not a doctor but I've been around enough autistic children/people to spot them. A lot of my students have been homeschooled are just as well-adjusted as people who go to school. My little brother has been homeschooled his entire life and works full time, is about to start University, has loads of friends, a girlfriend, etc. Not all homeschoolers are socially fucked.
@12:03; I haven't even looked at WebMD. Seems to be that anyone with common sense can see that something is wrong with her. Believe what you want. This is what I believe.
Not all people who get homeschooled look like a monkey. That bitch has a face that shows signs of something wrong.
You've always looked like an idiot, fatass Moar, but you're really outdoing yourself here. There isn't a "test" for FAS, so while attempting to establish superiority please at least verify your claims.
lol so, you teaching disabled kids music makes you some kind of expert on all of them now? well thanks, doctor!
Stop fucking trolling each other, plz
12:05 - I clearly said that I wasn't a doctor.
forreal! i was homeschooled and i'm not like kai at all. way to play up a stereotype though. lol
12:06 clearly you don't understand sarcasm.
12:04 #2 im not going to sit here and say kai DOES NOT HAVE blah blah, because i have never met her irl or have seen her test results. stop acting like you know shit. you might have symptoms of the common cold and then it turns out you have some rare disease.
12:07 - Well then what's your fucking point? You don't think that someone that has years of experience with children w/ disabilities could maybe spot someone with them? Really? Okay then.
"you might have symptoms of the common cold and then it turns out you have some rare disease."
Profound statements from Moar the Heifer.
Lets stop fighting and talk about the good times with kai, in case she doesn't come back.
fox tan.
eye shit.
i know i'm not a makeup artist.
fish net dresses.
we love you kai!
moar fail, you are just being complicated..
honestly just bc kai LOOKS like she has FAS, doesn't mean she has it. and just bc she's socially inept, doesn't mean she's got aspergers.
it's just stupid to speculate.
////
This is different though. Kai was homeschooled and taught by her mother and not a teacher. David even said she bullshitted through all of her school work and never taught Kai properly. Not all homeschoolers are fucked but you need SOME form of human interaction. Kai is socially awkward because she wasn't raised around other kids. She doesn't know how to act around people. Lack of education, human interaction and being babied seem more reasonable than just diagnosing her with a bunch of disabilities.
i wasn't sure if kailyn had any real problems until i saw her on blogtv... remember when she got upset and started pacing? yeeeah. :/
i no i'm not the best
skirt collection
Or even just her laugh, the seal-like laugh. Not kosher.
12:11 omg no when/how did that happen?
when did she pace?
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